As far as I remember, RAMA’s PCBs pre-WIlba were… kind of a hit and miss, no?
For what it’s worth, before the M60-A RAMA licensed his designs to third party sellers/producers. The in-house production move stemmed from the frustration of the mismanagement of products associated to his brand. However yes, you are correct, some of the PCBs pre-M60-A era were not the best.
I think these details on the PCB are new.
Foam layer between the PCB & MUTE mat
Both also coming to the Kara Seq. 2!
Mind anyone share screenshots for the paranoid folks not having IG accounts? It would be very much appreciated!
Here’s the text of the posts:
RAMA WORKS® M60-B - each M60-B comes with a PE foam overlay which sits between the PCB and MUTE for an extra muted sound profile - M60-B — RAMA WORKS®
The M60-B PCB with flex-cuts to provide an enhanced typing experience - we’ll also be including this upgrade to the KARA SEQ2 orders along with the additional PE Foam layer!
Happy Holidays from the team at RAMA WORKS
Thank you!
What’s the general feel in the community about the M60-B? Cop or drop?
My finger is still hovering the checkout button, even though the increase in price is still a bit painful. I’m currently rocking a M60-A, which unfortunately has two busted PCB-mount threads (from the previous owner) and a KARA. Having the KARA mount in an aluminum enclosure sounds very tempting, however, with GBs like the Peac PLX (HHKB) launching soon I’m unsure whether the M60 is still worth it in 2022.
Edit: Also, does the PCB/MUTE update mean that the KARA (Wilba) PCB is going to fit the M60-B? 
Additional subassembly kit for M60-B
Cross-compatible with KARA
So just to clarify in case you’re confused @mrus
The subassembly above is already included with the M60-B kit.
This new PCB will be in the KARA Seq2 as well yea? Replacing the Wilba ones…
So… going to be interesting to see whether they get via access…
See @_PixelNinja post above re Via support.
Now that I’ve been using my U80 for about a week, I am much more tempted by this new gasket mount M60.
Unfortunately shipping to the US seems to be over $60. I don’t remember shipping costs for the KARA to be that high. Is it due to the weight or have shipping costs increased significantly?
//edit: Just double-checked, shipping for the KARA + dampener was $25.
//edit: Without the additional back-weight it’s $47.81 for the M60. Cheaper, but still nearly double the price than for the KARA + dampener. According to the RAMA site, the KARA + dampener weights approximately 800g. If we add 200g for the packaging and whatnot it’s basically around 1kg. For the M60-B they state 1600 grams, with around 200g of packaging added that’s around 1.8kg or nearly double. So, yes, if weight is charged proportionally the costs might indeed be valid. However, I know too little about B2B shipping of such goods internationally to tell if it’s really a proportional increase based on weight.
//edit: So, turns out the shipping is as following:
~$47 for only the M60
~$61 for the M60 + 1 back weight
~$66 for the M60 + 2 back weights
~$66 for the M60 + 1 back weights + 1 internal weight
~$76 for the M60 + 2 back weights + 1 internal weight
~$71 for the M60 + 1 back weight + 1 internal weight + 1 dampener
~$76 for the M60 + 1 back weight + 1 internal weight + 1 dampener + 1 kuro subassembly
~$91 for the M60 + 1 back weight + 1 internal weight + 1 dampener + 1 kuro subassembly + another M60
~$88 for three M60s
Whatever it is that decides pricing, it does seem to include a discount depending on the total value of the cart. If you’re willing to spend over 1k it looks like the shipping costs don’t increase proportionally anymore - or they might even be lower. Ordering three M60s where a single one would cost $47 (times 3 → $141) suddenly only costs $88 in shipping. If you could get domestic shipping for as little as $15 per board, you could chip in with two of your friends, order 3 boards to a single person and then have them ship the other two for a total of $30 domestically. That way you could have saved $23 in shipping or $7.6 per person. This approach also seems to scale pretty well, because ordering 6 boards would only cost $129 in shipping, leading to even higher savings for everyone involved.
Playing devil’s advocate: Kara shipped with two packages inside one box (one for housing, one for PCB, etc). It is unclear if ordering an additional backplate would involve it being included inside one of those two packages, or if it would require an additional third box (additional weight and volume). Shipping cost teeters between size and weight – not always a 1-1 correlation between the two and sometimes you get bumped up a tier if any of the two variables surpass a threshold pre-determined by the shipper.
Specifically, all freight and most parcel services (these days) determine cost based on which “weight” is higher, actual weight or dimensional weight.
I believe the fact that ordering 6 M60 only costs $21 per board in shipping kind of shows that it’s not a 1-1 correlation, as you correctly stated. However, it also seems to proof that it’s kind of related to the amount of money you burn. The more you’re willing to spend the better of a deal you seem to be getting on shipping. So either shipping costs are artificially higher for smaller transactions or higher transactions are discounted in regard of their shipping. Or both.
Shipping prices keep increasing (both freight and parcel delivery). Who knows what they’ll be in a year (especially to and from Australia). At least Rama isn’t forcing folks to pay up the difference when fulfilment finally does take place.
Well, you are correct, but that is speculation. So, if we speculate, then let’s do it properly.
Assuming that a downwards trend will continue throughout global markets, one might say that many people will likely flip the keyboard upon arrival - paying rent and food might end up being more important than a nice keyboard when it suddenly becomes more complicated to make ends meet.
While the dollar will likely continue to decrease in value, the nominal price for which it’ll be getting sold is unlikely to increase by the same amount in addition to the aftermarket markup price. Obviously mechmarket has notoriously inflated prices. However, the current trend on mechmarket, averaged by a vast range of other, already existing RAMA products, shows, that even BNIB items today go for more or less the same price (and sometimes even below) what RAMA themselves initially sold them for - if you factor in inflation.
Putting this aside for a moment, let’s continue the speculation and assume that we would allocate the exact amount of the M60-B (including shipping) right now and invest it into something that at least holds this value (meaning, increases proportionally to the dollars inflation) or ideally yields more value over the next approx. 1 year, which I would assume is the time that it’ll take for BNIB M60-Bs to hit mechmarket. Even at “only” about 10% (“only”, since we’re not going into any high risk assets like crypto), our ~$600 would not only have hedged for the current inflation but also generated a bit of a return, netting us $660 after that one year.
Continuing where we left of, when BNIB M60-Bs will hit mechmarket, we could likely scoop up the items at no additional cost. Taking in consideration that, with higher risk, higher yields could be achieved, we might even end up paying less for the keyboard when purchased on the aftermarket. If we also factor in a global economic downturn and a high market saturation of BNIB items as soon as it ships, which are both factors that will drive down the prices, we might end up paying significantly less for the keyboard after all.
So unless people will hold on to their orders no matter what and unless you’d want a super-specific configuration that you will likely have a very hard time finding on the aftermarket, I’d suggest that putting the money into a different asset and purchasing the board on the aftermarket could make more sense (financially) than actually joining this groupbuy. That is also very much true for GMK keycaps, considering that delivery times are now past 2 years, allowing us to get a potentially higher total yield.
// edit: Just to clarify, I’m not saying that it’s a bad idea to put the money upfront and join the group buy. All I’m saying is that, while many folks on the aftermarket think they’re great businessmen, that is rarely the case and everyone who intentionally missed out on a GB might have the chance to actually benefit from the aftermarket when played right.